Can you identify this rocket/missile/bomb for me?

[Nicolas]

I'm planning on buying this thing to put it in my house:



No, seriously, I am.

The current owner knows little about it. He calls it both a rocket and a bomb. He thought it was for practice. The internals are empty, but that doesn't mean it always was like that. the top is steel, the rest aluminum. Height is just a bit more than 2.10m.

It is quite obviously from Germany. Googling on what's written on it turns up nothing, also the vague G-H-G on the top doesn't google well.

Can anyone tell me:

-what type it is
-whether it is a bomb, ground launched rocket or plane carried missile (the spiral paint job and shape of the fins make an external fuel tank unlikely to me)
-what it was used for (drop practice, launch practice, stability mockup...)
-how old it is
-how rare it is

The current asking price is a bit high for me, but I'd love to put it in my house. I've got a closed veranda in which it would fit nicely and hopefully not rust too much (on winter mornings, moisture will settle on the cold metal and there is a serious temperature difference summer/winter, day/night, but at least it's not out in the rain and bird poo).

Any info is welcome! The only thing looking a bit like this is a V2 (A4), which is much larger and not really something I'd want in my house...In fact I don't think I'd want any Nazi stuff in my house, but as I said I think that this thing is newer and only shares the looks and country with the V2.

[aurora]

It looks like a V2, only smaller. I wonder if it was a model, although I do not know when this one was made.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V-2_rocket

[Nicolas]

I know there were subscale models of a V2 and that they were given names, but they were or very small (like 90cm) or much larger (like 6 meters). The "41" could be a series number, a year, or something completely different.

But somehow, it looks quite a bit newer than a WW2 thing to me. No wood, the bolts (I have a larger picture) that hold the fins are decent bolts and the fins are nicely rounded around the bolts.

[Argos]

No control surfaces. It suggests it might be an aerial bomb, or a model.

[Nicolas]

There are indeed no control surfaces (I can verify that with certainty on the larger pictures).

But the shape of the nose and fins that continue behind the body suggest a high speed. I haven't seen bombs that look like this. A model is possible, but it's large yet undetailed for a model. What kind of model would that be? Why this weird paint job? Why the extra attachment points between the wings? If it's a model, it looks like a model that had a certain use, not just some collector thing.

[novaderrik]

anyone ever see Joe Dirt?
maybe it's like that nuclear bomb he found in the desert..

[Jay200MPH]

Not a V2 - Germany didn't use those colours during the second world war, so it probably isn't from that era. Unless it's been repainted for some reason.

[Nicolas]

As I said, since it's 2.1 meters tall it certainly is not a V2. The colours are unlike WW2, as is the construction. So it's quite a lot more recent. But when/what/why is it then? What did any army use these kind of things for? When would the german army have put a name on a rocket like that?

It's strange. Something doesn't look right. But if it's a fake paint job, then why not go all the way with all the WW2 insigna or a decent "V2 rocketry test" paint job? If it's a contraption (fuel tank with fins or something) then why these nice extra connectors at the fins, why the lack of hardpoints on the sides? Strange, strange...

[chrissy]

Maybe it has something to do with the "cold war".

[Nicolas]

I've been googling on that era as well. Found nothing alike...

[chrissy]

Did you come up with the name Henke, I think this guy invented a rocket for the purpose of launching it, I came across some literature where this guy was mentioned.

[Scamp]

Be sure to let us know what happens when you check that on your flight home...

[Nicolas]

I've found some Henke's in literature as well, and most of them I wouldn't have in my house...That's why I'd find it strange if they'd put this name on an official (mockup) weapon after WW2. It's a common name, but still...

Quite a mystery, this thing...I don't want to buy it before I know at least that it's real (no matter what/from when it is) but not too nazi.

[chrissy]

*LOL* post WWII, so there shouldn't be any worries about that.

It looks fake to me Nicolas, probably a replica.

[Nicolas]

If it's a replica, why go through all the pain of making a nice steel and aluminum shape and then put some seemingly random (no historical link whatsoever) paint job on it?

it seems more likely to me that it is indeed some cold war era practice thing made in series, and that the paint job was done by the military and personalised, with the "Henke" on this one refering to a local guy.

Still, I'd like to know what practice thing this was.

[01101001]

I don't know. I picture it in a previous life attached to an electric motor with a rotary cam, said motor activated by the insertion of a 25-cent coin, by a parent-type person.

The smile child riding atop the rocket went, "Whee!"

[VARN]

G.H.G. stands for Gruppenhorchgeräte which was the U-boat's group listening apparatus.

and Werner Henke was a U-Boat captain.

[Nicolas]

@ 01101001: If it would have been fibre plastic, feature a small red leather seat with steel hand grip, a would-be Looney Tunes character stickered on it and have paint-on chrome, I'd say "got it!". But it seems a bit too sturdy for an amusement park decoration.

@Vern: I'll check out that link. Maybe it's a museum/exhibition prop of a museum that doesn't care too much about being correct? (V2, U-boat...). But as Henke is a common name (you can easily find 10 Henkes related to WW2, and probably thousands unrelated to it), the G-H-G could be the initials of a trainee group of three persons, with a Henke being one of them, and this practice...thing having a custom paint job for him. Maybe they had to paint all their "own" practice...things themselves, allowing them some creativity in Boot camp. With no info at all, any explanation is a good one.

It just seems strange to me that any reasonable person would make a paint job some years after WW2 refering to a WW2 nazi U-boat captain. That was quite not-done. So that makes it logical to me that a person also named Henke was involved in the paint job.

[VARN]

project Prufstand XII was a plan to launch V2s at new york since the V2s were too large to fit in the hull they were dragged behind the u-boat inside a water tight container.

[Nicolas]

This particular "V2" being only 2.1m tall, it would have fitted into the hull, unless the Germans were a lot smaller 60 years ago than I always imagined.

We can make a link between V2's, U-Boats, and a Henke, but somehow I think this one has nothing to do with that. I don't think WW2 has anything to do with this thing.

[Jeff Root]

Nicolas,

I would expect that "Henke" is either the name of the device model or
the manufacturer. I'd think you could find info on it on a German military
website. My guess about the bolts holding the fins is that was a low-cost
way to attach them with minimal intrusion into the body. The fins have a
very long chord but short span. That is unusual and should help identify it.
The tapered body must be significantly more expensive to make than a
straight-sided cylindrical body, so there must be a good reason for it.

The only reference to a small German-made rocket that I have is in a
book, 'Spacecraft and Missiles of the World, 1966'. In the chapter on
tactical missiles I find the West German 'Cobra' surface-to-surface missile,
which became operational in 1960. It is much smaller than yours, length
78 cm, diameter 10 cm, weight 9 kg. A photo shows it being carried by a
US Marine, marked 'COBRA' and 'USMC'. My guess is that 'Cobra' is the
American name, and that the book for some reason doesn't include the
German name. Unless 'Cobra' is the same in English and German. The
prime contractor and manufacturer of the frame and guidence system
was Boelkow; the manufacturer of the propulsion system was Oerlikon.

-- Jeff, in Minneapolis

[Nicolas]

The body shape and fin shape all say "high speed" to me. Though an older approach to "high speed", as the body is quite "fat". But these long fins are what we used to design for rocketry as well.

This "Henke" can't be googled, at least not in a relevant way. I'll have to wait for more info from the owner.

The shape seems to good to be a cheap homebrew thing, but the functionality seems very low which would make a practice mockup thing likely.

[Sam5]

Could the black, red, and gold colors represent the Federal Republic of Germany?

http://flagspot.net/flags/de.html

[DaveC426913]

As I said, since it's 2.1 meters tall it certainly is not a V2.

No, that makes it a ... 2.1/14.0*2.0= ... v0.317.


Thanks. I'm here all fish, try the week.

[HenrikOlsen]

Could the black, red, and gold colors represent the Federal Republic of Germany?

http://flagspot.net/flags/de.html

From the OP:

It is quite obviously from Germany.

[Jay200MPH]

My bet would be a prop for some kind of silly cold-war movie. Along the lines of "Dr. Strangelove".

[Nicolas]

JayUtah is the local prop builder here, but how often are B-movie (look at the thing, it is either completely genuine or a terrible fake ) props made completely from heavy steel and aluminum? I'd expect a thin, light construction which shows faults on close inspection, but this a heavy guy that looks manufactured well also in close-up.

And the little that the owner does know about it, is that it was used for some kind of practice (so we'd have to look into the training/exercise/tests using mockups corner is my guess).

Exercise bombs are usually made from concrete. Exercise missiles are not, they usually are the real thing with a different warhead.

Does this thing look like a bomb, fuel tank, ground launched missile or air launched missile to you?

[Moose]

I'm just wondering if we're getting faked out a bit, whether or not the Henke 41 happens to have been a street address (in Germany, hence the decor) in the object's past (and the presence of the bomb itself being the tribute to Henke). It may be a stripped out bomb from some other country.

I don't recognize it, though, but I'd guess it's a dropped object rather than a launched one, for the same reason as the others. No control surfaces.

[Argos]

I knew I had seen it before. Obviously, itīs the BA rocket.

[Jeff Root]

The one thing that makes me think it is a missile rather than a bomb is the
squared-off bottom. If the bottom is open, I'd say it is a missile. If it has
a cover over the bottom which is obviously part of the basic design, not
just an add-on, then it must not be a missile.

-- Jeff, in Minneapolis