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Thread: Don Alejandro - Mayan Elder.

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  1. #1

    Don Alejandro - Mayan Elder.

    So yeah, there I am reading up more on 2012 (not panicking mind you )

    And came across this little tidbit(it's long!) about Don Alejandro

    Don Alejandro is charged as the primary keeper of the teachings, visions and prophecies of the Mayan people. He is head of the National Mayan Council of Elders of Guatemala, Day Keeper of the Mayan Calendar, a 13th generation Quiche Mayan High Priest and a Grand Elder of the Continental Council of Elders and Spiritual Guides of the Americas. He is also an international lecturer on Mayan Culture.
    And Mr.Alejandro says

    "He [Carlos] said Mayan Daykeepers view the Dec. 21, 2012 date as a rebirth, the start of the World of the Fifth Sun. It will be the start of a new era resulting from and signified by the solar meridian crossing the galactic equator, and the earth aligning itself with the center of the galaxy. At sunrise on December 21, 2012 for the first time in 26,000 years the Sun rises to conjunct the intersection of the Milky Way and the plane of the ecliptic. This cosmic cross is considered to be an embodiment of the Sacred Tree, The Tree of Life, a tree remembered in all the world's spiritual traditions. Some observers say this alignment with the heart of the galaxy in 2012 will open a channel for cosmic energy to flow through the earth, cleansing it and all that dwells upon it, raising all to a higher level of vibration.
    Seems like an interesting and rational mayan belief, well alot better than a laser beam exploding us do to planetary alignment!

    The link is http://alignment2012.com/eldersand2012.html

    Carl Calleman - http://www.calleman.com/ (He's the one mentioning the elder)

    And also - Evidence! http://alignment2012.com/mayan2012statements.html

    Enjoy! By all means, shoot down ideas in this thread mind you

  2. #2
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    Re: Don Alejandro - Mayan Elder.

    OK.
    He [Carlos] said Mayan Daykeepers view the Dec. 21, 2012 date as a rebirth, the start of the World of the Fifth Sun. It will be the start of a new era resulting from and signified by the solar meridian crossing the galactic equator,
    If that means what I understand the "solar meridian" to mean, then, it does that twice a year during June and December.
    and the earth aligning itself with the center of the galaxy.
    This seems to be meaningless. If the Earth and the center of the galaxy are taken as two points, then, guess what? There's no "alignment". One needs three points to determine an alignment.
    At sunrise on December 21, 2012 for the first time in 26,000 years the Sun rises to conjunct the intersection of the Milky Way and the plane of the ecliptic.
    If this is supposed to mean the Sun is located, as seen from Earth, at the same location as the galactic center, then, no, it doesn't. It's off by 5 degrees of arc, i.e., about 10 Moon diameters, as shown in this post. Be sure to check the link to the star chart.

    Otherwise, what will actually happen is a ho-hum annual event produced by the orbit of the Earth. The Sun is close to the galactic equator every year around the winter solstice.

    Senor Carlos may be well-versed in Mayan mythology and calendars, but his astronomical expertise is wanting.

  3. #3
    Senor Carlos may be well-versed in Mayan mythology and calendars, but his astronomical expertise is wanting.
    I agree, but that's just it, the Mayans did not have the technology we do today.
    But even this "elder" doesn't believe that the world is going to end, all this 2012 nonsense is taken from that, I think this can easily clarify some of the situation(or so I believe)

    Oh, he also claims that we will pass through a "Dark-rift" for about 60-70 hours, and doesn't know the out-come this is going to have on earth..

    Now, as far as I can tell, there is no "Dark-rift" that is in the path of the earths orbit around the sun. Around then.(Agreeing with Maksutov, this guy is not a top-notch Astronomer.)

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    Re: Don Alejandro - Mayan Elder.

    BTW, the same kind of thing happens every summer solstice too. See this star chart for where the Sun is when summer (in the northern hemisphere) starts. Note the proximity to the galactic equator.

    The doomsayers must have a thing against summer.


  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exirus View Post
    I agree, but that's just it, the Mayans did not have the technology we do today.
    But even this "elder" doesn't believe that the world is going to end, all this 2012 nonsense is taken from that, I think this can easily clarify some of the situation(or so I believe)

    Oh, he also claims that we will pass through a "Dark-rift" for about 60-70 hours, and doesn't know the out-come this is going to have on earth..

    Now, as far as I can tell, there is no "Dark-rift" that is in the path of the earths orbit around the sun. Around then.(Agreeing with Maksutov, this guy is not a top-notch Astronomer.)
    I can't claim expertise about the Mayans (though I did study them in college), and god forbid I speack against a Mayan elder, but this sounds like hogwash. I studied Mayan astronomy, I do not recall any indication that they knew what a galaxy was or that it had a center to align to, and I do not recall anything about a "dark-rift". I think Don Alejandro has spent too much time with new-agers on the internet, and not enough time studying Mayan codexes.

    Just my humble opinion.
    At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

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  6. #6
    Well, the guy who was translating it translated it into "Dark-rift" he doesn't know exactly if this is what he was saying.. So the elder could be talking about something completely different.

  7. #7
    The doomsayers must have a thing against summer.
    I know I do! It gets awful hot where I live.

  8. #8
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    See, just as I have said. In Mayan cosmology, the end of a long count cycle is a begining or "rebirth", not an end.

  9. #9
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    In my brain, Don Alejandro is Zorro's father. I'm certain he doesn't know anything about the Mayans.
    _____________________________________________
    Gillian

    "Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

    "You can't erase icing."

    "I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

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    That's O.K.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gillianren View Post
    In my brain, Don Alejandro is Zorro's father. I'm certain he doesn't know anything about the Mayans.
    That's O.K. I on the other hand have "Alejaaaaaaaaaaandroooooooooooo!!!! Maaaaaaaaaaaayaaaaaaaaa!!!" running thought my head ad nauseum

    (That's a Heroes joke for those who are confused)

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Exirus View Post
    So yeah, there I am reading up more on 2012[...]
    Another day, another 2012 topic for my collection:

    2003 no, 2012 si
    2012
    Pole shift / Planetary alignment 2012?
    2012 alignment question
    about the Mayan 2012 item
    2012 Debunking?
    Possible asteroid impact in 2012?
    2012 asteroid?
    We don't have to worry about 2012!
    More on 2012 from India Daily
    2012 Completion of conspiracy?
    Here's what's REALLY going to happen in 2012...
    crop circles, Planet X and 2012
    Planet X, crop circles and 2012 cataclysma
    According to the Mayans, what will happen on 23rd Dec. 2012?
    More 2012 Nonsense
    NEO 2012?
    Dangerous NEO in 2012?
    Christmas 2012
    2012 mayan calender end of world
    Regarding the supposed polar shift/new ice age in 2012
    New 2012 threat?
    2012 look at this thing on the sun
    Russian Expert Predicts Global Cooling from 2012
    Pole shift idea origins
    Dec 20 2012
    2012 Stuff
    Horizon Project-New End of World Scare?
    Date: December 21st 2012
    Earth passing thru Galactic center in 2012 - didn't that already happen?
    2012: What do you think well happen (if anything)
    So what will we see in 2012?
    Galactic Tsunami?
    Plane of the ecliptic of the galaxy?
    Earth's Magnetic Field & 2012
    2012?
    Any truth to this?
    How can the sun be aligned with Galactic centre?
    the whole 2012 poles flip nonsense
    Planet X Official Advertisement
    What year are we in
    Quick question about the sun
    Galactic Alignment
    Books of 2012! -
    2007 = 2012
    Return of Planet X By Rand
    Don Alejandro - Mayan Elder.

    More, more, more! This important and significant issue cannot be overpromoted.

    Or... can it?
    0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 0 ...

  12. #12
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    More, more, more! This important and significant issue cannot be overpromoted.
    Or... can it?
    DELL: The proof is all around you! You act like nothing's happened!
    SHAGGY: We can try. (Starts whistling)
    -Scooby Doo and the Loch Ness Monster

  13. #13
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    Five more years of this nonsense? Well it will be worth it on December 22, 2012 when all the believers climb out of their various holes, come down from the mountains and figure out that basically-nothing has changed.

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    Re: Don Alejandro - Mayan Elder.

    Problem is, they'll just pick another date to worry about. Pretty sure 2032 is already in the running. Or was that 2023? Oh well, 6.5 of one, half a baker's dozen of the other.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hans View Post
    Five more years of this nonsense? Well it will be worth it on December 22, 2012 when all the believers climb out of their various holes, come down from the mountains and figure out that basically-nothing has changed.
    No, they'll just rationalize it away and stay huddled for the "real" end of the world.
    I'm a cynical optimist. I think the only way out is through, but once we get through it'll be better. Very different, but better. Howard Tayler

    It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. Charles Darwin

    "It is the duty of the writers to seduce me into suspending my disbelief!" Paul Beardsley

    Power, Lord Acton says, corrupts. Not always. What power always does is reveal. Robert A. Caro

  16. #16
    Dun dun DUN, You need to be able to "BAN" people from the internet, would solve a lot of these problems.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Exirus View Post
    Dun dun DUN, You need to be able to "BAN" people from the internet, would solve a lot of these problems.
    It wouldn't.
    There always has been a lunatic fringe.

    And if you start with that, where would it end?
    A one-man internet. Pretty useless.

  18. #18
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    The Mexican Maya I know don't recognize this guy as any sort of leader, nor the groups with which he is affiliated as representatives of their culture or heritage. Granted the mileage of Guatemala Maya may differ.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
    The Mexican Maya I know don't recognize this guy as any sort of leader, nor the groups with which he is affiliated as representatives of their culture or heritage. Granted the mileage of Guatemala Maya may differ.
    And even if he was some kind of a Maya religious leader, why should we listen to him instead of a bishop, or a lama?
    Why should we accept whatever the Maya religion (allegedly) prophesies? What makes it more real that any of the other religions and prophecies in existence?
    Do the doom sayers have any reason or justification for that?

  20. #20
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    Five more years of this nonsense? Well it will be worth it on December 22, 2012 when all the believers climb out of their various holes, come down from the mountains and figure out that basically-nothing has changed.
    As they did on January First, 2000, June Seventh, 2006, and probably countless days before.

  21. #21
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    Well, if even the actual Maya religion does not fit what the doomsayers are saying (which is the case), it certainly says something for their case.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by KaiYeves View Post
    Well, if even the actual Maya religion does not fit what the doomsayers are saying (which is the case), it certainly says something for their case.

    Huh? What certainly does? For whose case?
    I'm a cynical optimist. I think the only way out is through, but once we get through it'll be better. Very different, but better. Howard Tayler

    It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. Charles Darwin

    "It is the duty of the writers to seduce me into suspending my disbelief!" Paul Beardsley

    Power, Lord Acton says, corrupts. Not always. What power always does is reveal. Robert A. Caro

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Noclevername View Post

    Huh? What certainly does? For whose case?
    That the doomsayers are saying the mayans said that it's the end of the world, but that's not true in this case, is what she's saying I believe.

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    If you believe that the end of world will occur on December 21st, 2012 you also have to accept that the world was created in 3114 BC. Of course in Mayan belief the "end" just means a change.

    But of course after the passing of THIS nonsense more nonsense will follow, that is what makes fringe so interesting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hans View Post
    But of course after the passing of THIS nonsense more nonsense will follow, that is what makes fringe so interesting.
    Actually, it makes it tedious IMO. Like "The Boy Who Cried Wolf", without the wolf.
    I'm a cynical optimist. I think the only way out is through, but once we get through it'll be better. Very different, but better. Howard Tayler

    It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. Charles Darwin

    "It is the duty of the writers to seduce me into suspending my disbelief!" Paul Beardsley

    Power, Lord Acton says, corrupts. Not always. What power always does is reveal. Robert A. Caro

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    Huh? What certainly does? For whose case?
    The case of the doomsayers.
    But of course after the passing of THIS nonsense more nonsense will follow, that is what makes fringe so interesting.
    Why do they want the world to end? Can't they just wake up and appreciate what a beautiful world it is?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KaiYeves View Post
    Why do they want the world to end? Can't they just wake up and appreciate what a beautiful world it is?
    Because then they'd have no doom to say, and no one would pay attention to them.

    Most, but not all, "doomsayers" also have the "my knowledge makes me one of those who will be spared" syndrome, allowing them to feel superior to the "sheeple" who believe the "illusions" put forth by "The Man".
    I'm a cynical optimist. I think the only way out is through, but once we get through it'll be better. Very different, but better. Howard Tayler

    It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. Charles Darwin

    "It is the duty of the writers to seduce me into suspending my disbelief!" Paul Beardsley

    Power, Lord Acton says, corrupts. Not always. What power always does is reveal. Robert A. Caro

  28. #28
    Carl Calleman seems to me like a Carlos Castaneda wannabe who's found his Don Juan in Don Alejandro. Smells like a bad case of new age rubbish to me!

  29. #29
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    Because then they'd have no doom to say, and no one would pay attention to them.
    Most, but not all, "doomsayers" also have the "my knowledge makes me one of those who will be spared" syndrome, allowing them to feel superior to the "sheeple" who believe the "illusions" put forth by "The Man".
    Seriously, though, that anyone would feel in such a way depressed me. You don't need attention and book deals and 'I will be spared, but you will die' junk.
    Get a couch. Get a book of poetry. Get a blanket. Get some tea. And you will have all the hapiness you need.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by KaiYeves View Post
    Get a couch. Get a book of poetry. Get a blanket. Get some tea. And you will have all the hapiness you need.
    Different people are made happy by different things.
    I'm a cynical optimist. I think the only way out is through, but once we get through it'll be better. Very different, but better. Howard Tayler

    It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. Charles Darwin

    "It is the duty of the writers to seduce me into suspending my disbelief!" Paul Beardsley

    Power, Lord Acton says, corrupts. Not always. What power always does is reveal. Robert A. Caro

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