DEPTHX Robot explores Cenote Zacatón

[Blob]

Scientists return this week to the world’s deepest known sinkhole, Cenote Zacatón in Mexico, to resume tests of a NASA-funded robot called DEPTHX, designed to survey and explore for life in one of Earth’s most extreme regions and potentially in outer space.
If all goes well with this second round of testing and exploration, the team will return in May for a full-scale exploration of the Zacatón system.
Sinking more than 1,000 feet, Zacatón has only been partially mapped and its true depth remains unknown.

Read more

Latitude: 22.993135° Longitude: -98.161352°

[Lord Jubjub]

If such a vessel were to be put on Europa to melt down through the ice, how close would the mother ship have to be to pick up signal?

Would they park in orbit or would the mother ship have to land?

[Blob]

Scientists this week begin the final leg of a five-year, NASA-funded mission to reach the bottom of Cenote Zacatón in Mexico, the world’s deepest known sinkhole.
No one has ever reached bottom and at least one diver has died in the attempt. Scientists want to learn more about Cenote Zacatón's physical dimensions, the geothermal vents that feed it and the forms of life that exist in its murky depths.

The mission’s progress can be monitored at two Web sites: geology.com, and the Robotics Institute’s DEPTHX Web site, www.frc.ri.cmu.edu, which will feature daily updates, images and graphics.

Source


@Lord Jubjub
i don`t know...

[Launch window]

I know many at NASA have wanted to do the Europa thing and the ESA also studied a Jovian Explorer but nothing has really come to pass yet, especially as more NASA cuts loom


One of the problems is we don't really know a whole lot about this icey world that orbits Jupiter, what is under the ice, what is the composition ? what are the temperatures, how thick is the ice ?
Communication will become an obstacle, how is the drilling robot going to keep in touch with the orbiter ?

One option would be to use Very low frequecy in the robotic driller/swimmer, have a craft with huge aerials but then again we don't know how effective this will be through the materials in that Moon.

The other idea could be to go sonar, like the submarines but the tiny bandwith transmitted could make the journey almost worthless

Or you could send a Lander with huge reels of optic cable for Mega bandwith and keep supplying the Driller/Swimmer with slack the more it sinks into Europa, however there are also problems with this as the cable could snap and large reels of cable will add a lot of weight to a mission which without a heavy lift rocket could have difficulty getting larger payloads to Jupiter's Moon.

[Blob]

For NASA, the $5 million, three-year Deep Phreatic Thermal Explorer (Depthx) project is an important test drive of a computerized, underwater vehicle that makes all of its own decisions -- where to swim, which samples to collect and how to get home. Each day, the battery-powered robot will travel deeper into the sinkhole, exploring nooks and crannies that human divers could never reach.
If Clementine performs well, a retooled version will head to Antarctica's Lake Bonney next year. Scientists think the conditions there -- vast thermal waterways below frozen ice -- more closely resemble those of Europa.

Source

Lake Bonney is a two-and-a-half mile long, one-mile wide, 130 foot-deep lake located in the continent's McMurdo Dry Valleys. Bonney lies perpetually trapped beneath 12 to 15 feet of ice.

[Lord Jubjub]

Results of the first dive.

[cbacba]

Scientists return this week to the world’s deepest known sinkhole, Cenote Zacatón in Mexico, to resume tests of a NASA-funded robot called DEPTHX, designed to survey and explore for life in one of Earth’s most extreme regions and potentially in outer space.
If all goes well with this second round of testing and exploration, the team will return in May for a full-scale exploration of the Zacatón system.
Sinking more than 1,000 feet, Zacatón has only been partially mapped and its true depth remains unknown.

Read more

Latitude: 22.993135° Longitude: -98.161352°

First it's zacaton, then next maybe lake vostock and maybe one day europa.

Last I heard, the idea for europa was a lander on the surface and the robot and tender to melt through to the bottom. So far it seems that the idea for the robot is untethered although there may be some considerations of a tether - just in case there are strong currents.

Although it's a big heavy monster, it seems to be a rather neat design.

[Blob]

Hum,
the word on the street says they`ll head back home for a nice cuppa; then Lake Bonney..

Latitude: -77.7248, Longitude: 162.46 (ice station location)

Stunning images here:
http://www.aber.ac.uk/~glawww/antarctic.shtml

Map:
http://huey.colorado.edu/LTER/datase...y/metlocs.html

[Larry Jacks]

If such a vessel were to be put on Europa to melt down through the ice, how close would the mother ship have to be to pick up signal?

If the vessel tried to communicate directly using radio signals, you'd have a lot of problems. About the only radio frequencies that can penetrate deep into water (much less through very thick ice) are very low or ultra low frequencies. Very low frequencies (VLF) are those between 300-3000 Hz and ultra low frequenceis (ULF) are between 0-300 Hz. Frequences this low require very long antennas (heavy) and are naturally limited to very low data rates (a few bits per second, tops). I used to operate a SLFCS transmitter in Nebraska (1980-82). We transmitted in the medium frequency band (3-30 kHz) and our high speed data rate was 50 bits per second.

I think a better way would be for the lander to leave the communications system on the surface while the exploration vehicle trails out a fibre optic cable behind it connected to the lander. This would naturally limit the range that the exploration vehicle could cover to the length of the cable but that can be quite long. TOW missiles trail a couple of guidance wires for ranges up to about 5 kilometers. Submarine torpedos are often wire guided and can range for many miles. I'd hope the vehicle could carry at least 10-20 kilometers of cable.

[cbacba]

Hum,
the word on the street says they`ll head back home for a nice cuppa; then Lake Bonney..

Latitude: -77.7248, Longitude: 162.46 (ice station location)

Stunning images here:
http://www.aber.ac.uk/~glawww/antarctic.shtml

Map:
http://huey.colorado.edu/LTER/datase...y/metlocs.html

All I can say was last time I talked to my friend, I don't think bonney was mentioned but vostok and europa were. However, he's been down at least twice to zacaton since then with the depth-x critter. I'll have to find out some more about it next time I see him. Unfortunately, it's usually not a real good format to learn much about anything (other people get bored real quick and try to change the subject).

[pottsynz]

Would the real probe use batteries? Wouldn't it need a RTG to last longer than a day? Then you've got possible contamination issues. Def not an easy one for sure.

[cbacba]

Would the real probe use batteries? Wouldn't it need a RTG to last longer than a day? Then you've got possible contamination issues. Def not an easy one for sure.

I don't think there's any way out of a radioactive (?) thermal generator. Melting through the ice would almost certainly require that sort of energy. Temperatures would drag semiconductors down to a crawl if they weren't heated to some sort of range near 0 F at least. Batteries would get frozen solid too. I'm not sure any of the outer planet probes functioned without needing a nuke reactor. Solar panels are just too whimp for such large distances from the sun.

[cbacba]

Finally talked to my friend again, back from zacaton. Evidently the vostak thing went out infavor of lake bonney. Also, stone aerospace is no longer prime contractor and it's being shifted elsewhere.
Depthx will still be used totake sensors down on the lake bonney thing.

It appears that the control system was a network of embedded linux processors which seems like a horrific approach just off hand.