9/11 was an inside job, and you debunkers are a joke

[Zlaya]

Consider this:

New York City: 2 planes hit 2 buildings. Few hours later, 3 buildings collapse neatly into their own footprint. Building 7 collapses neatly into its own footprint, even thought the Building 5 is damaged much more that 7 (http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles...wtccomplex.htm)

Fact: No building in the History of Skyscrapers has ever collapsed in such a ridicules way as the WTC buildings. Ever. Period. Stop thinking otherwise. Done.

If we accept the official story, then we have to rewrite the security parameters for skyscrapers. We have to rewrite the laws of physics. The official story relies on the fact that on 9/11 the laws of physics stopped.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe...in.block.fire/

All tree buildings left pools of molten iron under the rubble, red hot even weeks after the collapse.

http://www.infowars.com/images2/sept...6thermite3.jpg

Building 7 collapse is obviously a controlled demolition, just look at it:

http://www.youtube.com/v/osSdofWzuh4
http://www.youtube.com/v/V5rAfxL-5Bk
http://www.youtube.com/v/o8w0cWFJuEQ (even Dan Rather thinks so)

The molten iron is analyzed and traces of sulphur are found. This sulphurization was called "the biggest mystery of 9/11" by the New York Times. Steven Jones, and other respectable scientists have analyzed WTC steel samples, and found traces of Thermite.

(http://www.infowars.com/articles/sep...c_collapse.htm)

Thermite + sulphur = Thermate – military grade, dense material cutting charges.

http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html - read this, before you respond to this thread

You can go ahead an debunk the holographic planes, reptiles, and nuclear weapons. You can make fun of Loose Change – an excellent, but flawed documentary. You can even sell out the Popular Mechanics by firing all the fair editors and replacing them with spineless idiots (http://www.911podcasts.com/display.php?vid=158), but you can not debunk the scientific evidence, which leads towards only one plausible conclusion: the towers were brought down by Controlled Demolition.

No one from Popular Mechanics wants to debate the issue. They were asked to do so, but they declined the debate invitation

(http://nw0.info/files/Radio/Jack%20B...2006-08-23.mp3)

All are just pulling a ‘hit n run’ on the Truth Movement, debunking the strawmen, and ignoring the real issues, such as the fact that the hijackers were trained in the US, with your tax money, the fact that there were over 15 NORAD drills on 9/11/01 (how did Tim Osman (Osama) know about them?), the fact that Mohamed Atta, and Bin Ladin were a known CIA asset, the fact that 7 of 19 hijackers are still alive and well, the fact that the buildings fell at near free fall speeds, making the pancake effect only plausible to complete morons, the fact that Bin Laden is NOT wanted for 9/11 Crimes (http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/laden.htm), the fact that Bush himself said that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 (http://911blogger.com/node/2202 - don’t you feel like an idiot now?) and finally the fact that the Commission has finally admitted that the “Final Report” is full of lies. The list goes on and on and on and on…

Join the truth movement. We are in the right. Debunkers are wrong. It’s that simple. This is not a drill. This is not a joke. Your family is in danger as long as you accept the official fable. Your grandchildren are doomed if you don’t expose the Truth about 9/11.

9/11 was the new Perl Harbor, outlined in the PNAC document.

Do what is right, that’s all I ask of you. The Truth will set you free. Please?

[Monique]

Perl Harbor "inside job" also?? I learn in school was Japanese attack!!

[Zlaya]

Perl Harbor "inside job" also?? I learn in school was Japanese attack!!

I never said that. Japanese did attack the Perl Harbor, but our President at the time let them do it, so that we can enter WWII. It was allowed to happen, to be a pretext to enter the war.

[Monique]

I never said that. Japanese did attack the Perl Harbor, but our President at the time let them do it, so that we can enter WWII. It was allowed to happen, to be a pretext to enter the war.

Perhaps show evidence

[Zlaya]

Perhaps show evidence

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/pe...315/pearl.html
http://www.armageddononline.org/pear...conspiracy.php
http://www.pearlharbor41.com/
http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/20...no12_facts.htm
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...q=terror+storm

You could also just google it....

[Musashi]

Blah di blah blah blahdi blah blah. Try using the search function. Then try using new arguments.

[cjl]

Look at any one of the hundreds of threads that have been over these EXACT SAME points before.

Summary of every last one of those threads: Not one of these arguments holds water. Every single one is either a lie, an exaggeration, or can be explained easily with the actual cause, no consiracy needed.


As for all these "No building has ever..." claims, here's one for you:

No skyscraper has ever survived having a large, fully fueled passenger jet hit it at cruise velocity. Ever. Period. Done.

This renders all the other "buildings haven't done this" claims moot - no other building has been subjected to the same set of circumstances as they were.

[Zlaya]

Look at any one of the hundreds of threads that have been over these EXACT SAME points before.

Summary of every last one of those threads: Not one of these arguments holds water. Every single one is either a lie, an exaggeration, or can be explained easily with the actual cause, no consiracy needed.


As for all these "No building has ever..." claims, here's one for you:

No skyscraper has ever survived having a large, fully fueled passenger jet hit it at cruise velocity. Ever. Period. Done.

This renders all the other "buildings haven't done this" claims moot - no other building has been subjected to the same set of circumstances as they were.

Ignorance is bliss, no?

Did you even read through my post? Osama is NOT wanted for 9/11, Bush says Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11? Hellooooo? Knock, knock, McFly!

I feel like i landed in twilight zone, where im the only person to live in timespace from 01 through 06...

American attention span has been reduced to 2 minutes of "Survivor" thanks to all the fluoride in your water.

blinking idiots....

[01101001]

Zlaya, I suggest an immediate re-reading of Rules For Posting To This Board

you debunkers are a joke

idiots

You seem to have missed:

No cursing. This goes along with being polite. This website is read by a lot of kids, including young school kids who want to learn about astronomy, space, and space exploration. The Universe is a marvelous place, full of beauty and wonder, and if you despoil it by using bad language you will quickly invoke the ire of the administrators and moderators. Think of the language used on TV during an after-school special and you'll get the idea. Deliberately misspelled bad words, or replacing key letters with different characters or numbers will not be tolerated. Same goes with adult topics -- talk about them somewhere else.

and

Attack the ideas, not the person(s) presenting them. If you've got concerns with what someone is saying, feel free dismantle their arguments, but do not resort to ad hominem or personal attacks. Be mindful and respectful of others' feelings. If you feel that someone has crossed the line and insulted you, please contact one of the moderators via private message or e-mail. Don't write scathing posts in the forum to try and humiliate people publicly.

[sarongsong]

...You could also just google it [Pearl Harbor evidence]....

Much more fun googling Zlaya.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Much more fun googling Zlaya.

Hehe. Haha.

I am a crazy conspiracy nutcase. I believe in Bigfoot. I live in my mothers basement, and mastrubate constantly. I am a liberal hippie communist stoner. I have no proof for my claims. I hate America! I'm with the terrorists, because Bush said "If you're not with us, You are with the Terrorists".

Zlaya... this isn't Digg. You're going to have to grow up if you want to continue posting here. Once you've accomplished that, then perhaps we can have a serious discussion. Better yet, as was suggested, you could take the time to read the existing threads about 9/11...

[Architect]

Zlaya

Let me make a suggestion. The rest of you calm down for a minute.

This is a scientific board. Most of us are qualified in and/or work in fields relevant to the points you raise. All of us are willing to enter into discussion on the merits (or otherwise) of the points . Indeed many (all?) have already been covered comprehensively.

Now if you're really willing to consider the issues with an open mind, rather than have a slagging match then you're in the right place.

We will lay out the evidence and arguments in depth. But you will be expected to do likewise. You can't simply shout "Prison Planet" or "Jones" back at us; you'll have to be prepared to analyse and consider the points in depth.

Let me give a simple example. If you claim that steel doesn't fail under fire loadings, and you are shown examples of (say) Building Regulations the world over which actually recognise the problem then simply shouting "let's see pictures of some that fell down" just isn't on.

Or if you say "it was demolition" then be prepared for questioning not just on interpretations of video evidence but also physical remains of charges, how they were placed, comparison with eye witness accounts. and so on.

It might also be helpful if you tell us what your special area of interest is, and whether you have expertise in relevant fields. This isn't in order that we can go for ad hominen attacks (which are banned here) but rather to (say) stop Jay or myself explaining the ins and outs of plastic vs elastic structural modelling if you're already an engineer and know the details.

If that's all fine, then let's fire ahead.

If you don't like the broad thrust of it, then you're in the wrong place.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Consider this:

New York City: 2 planes hit 2 buildings. Few hours later, 3 buildings collapse neatly into their own footprint. Building 7 collapses neatly into its own footprint, even thought the Building 5 is damaged much more that 7

First, your timeframe is way off. WTC7 collapse something like 7 hours after the twin towers.

Second, there wasn't anything neat about WTC7's collapse. One of the mechanical penthouses on the roof collapsed into the building a full 5 seconds before the second penthouse, which was then followed by the rest of the building.

Fact: No building in the History of Skyscrapers has ever collapsed in such a ridicules way as the WTC buildings. Ever. Period. Stop thinking otherwise. Done.

Although I wouldn't call their collapses "ridicules" (sic), this is probably the most generally correct statement I've heard come from a CT. If you think this is suspicious, why not show us examples of similar buildings that have subjected to similar conditions (structural damage + fire)?

If we accept the official story, then we have to rewrite the security parameters for skyscrapers.

Begging the question. What are the "security parameters for skyscrapers"?

We have to rewrite the laws of physics. The official story relies on the fact that on 9/11 the laws of physics stopped.

How so?

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe...in.block.fire/

http://911myths.com/html/madrid_windsor_tower.html

[The Madrid Windsor Tower] featured a concrete core throughout, but with concrete columns up to the 21st floor and steel columns between the 22nd and 30th floors. Remarkably, despite the intensity and duration of the fire, the concrete floors and columns remained intact however, the steel supported floors above the 21st floor collapsed, leaving the concrete core in-situ and exposed.

Perhaps you can point out the differences between the Madrid Windsor and the WTC...

All tree buildings left pools of molten iron under the rubble, red hot even weeks after the collapse.

How do you know this is true? The only person who can be confirmed to have made this claim (and nowhere did it saying anything about "all three buildings" - you'll have to support that claim) said they heard it from someone else. So... the claim is already second-hand. Bad start.

Building 7 collapse is obviously a controlled demolition, just look at it:

We have. What about you?

http://www.kolumbus.fi/av.caesar/wtc/wtc7_2.jpg

Firefighters on the scene that day agree with the picture above.
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread....933#post807933

Steven Jones, and other respectable scientists have analyzed WTC steel samples, and found traces of Thermite.

Prof. Jones is a physicist, not a materials or chemical analyst. Neither are any of the other "scholars" in his club.

Join the truth movement. We are in the right. Debunkers are wrong. It’s that simple. This is not a drill. This is not a joke. Your family is in danger as long as you accept the official fable. Your grandchildren are doomed if you don’t expose the Truth about 9/11.

No, I don't think so.

9/11 was the new Perl Harbor, outlined in the PNAC document.

Do you even know what the "transition" they talk about actually is? Have you read that entire section in context? I doubt it...

[Grand_Lunar]

The molten iron is analyzed and traces of sulphur are found. This sulphurization was called "the biggest mystery of 9/11" by the New York Times.

As for the molten iron, that's mere rumor.

The sulpher isn't a mystery once you remember that there was diesel fuel stored for the emergencey generators.
Funny what a little bit of trivial knowledge about a particular fuel can lead to.

[antoniseb]

****ing idiots....

Zlaya has been banned for a week for this use of prohibitied language, and ad hom attack.

[Cylinder]

...and finally the fact that the Commission has finally admitted that the “Final Report” is full of lies.

Can you kindly point me to that statement? I don't think they said what you think they said. Thanks in advance.

[Wolverine]

Ignorance is bliss, no?

Did you even read through my post? Osama is NOT wanted for 9/11, Bush says Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11? Hellooooo? Knock, knock, McFly!

I feel like i landed in twilight zone, where im the only person to live in timespace from 01 through 06...

American attention span has been reduced to 2 minutes of "Survivor" thanks to all the fluoride in your water.

blinking idiots....

Hello, Zlaya. As was suggested above, it's crucial that you read and abide by our forum rules. If you wish to participate here, you must follow those rules.
You must be polite -- that includes not swearing, not insulting people.

2. Civility and Decorum

Politeness is the top rule here. Of course, we expect to have spirited debates! That’s fine, as long as the people involved extend one another basic respect. Disagreements are inevitable, but even in those situations you must still be nice.

Attack the ideas, not the person(s) presenting them. If you've got concerns with what someone is saying, feel free dismantle their arguments, but do not resort to ad hominem or personal attacks. Be mindful and respectful of others' feelings. If you feel that someone has crossed the line and insulted you, please contact one of the moderators via private message or e-mail. Don't write scathing posts in the forum to try and humiliate people publicly.

If these guidelines are not followed, the administrators/moderators will take swift and appropriate action, so please behave accordingly.

3. Language

No cursing. This goes along with being polite. This website is read by a lot of kids, including young school kids who want to learn about astronomy, space, and space exploration. The Universe is a marvelous place, full of beauty and wonder, and if you despoil it by using bad language you will quickly invoke the ire of the administrators and moderators. Think of the language used on TV during an after-school special and you'll get the idea. Deliberately misspelled bad words, or replacing key letters with different characters or numbers will not be tolerated. Same goes with adult topics -- talk about them somewhere else. If you do need to post something risqué, stick with arcane scientific terminology.

You were initially issued a suspension this morning for markedly violating our guidelines in your first posts here. After a conferral, that suspension has been lifted given that you're new here and we're willing to extend you a chance to participate in accordance with these guidelines. Please take advantage of this opportunity.
Be warned: if you continue to break any of our forum's rules, your stay here will be very short.

We have had a number of discussions devoted to the issues you raised in the OP. As others have mentioned, it would be beneficial if you used the Search feature to brush up on what's already been discussed here. Here's just a sampling of aspects which have been addressed, with scores of refutations:

http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=36547
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=39144
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=34793
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=35175
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=34746
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=35171
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=37585
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=41122
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=41575
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=45479
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=45583
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=45631
http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=40685

Do note that if you choose to argue in favor of any given conspiratorial scenario, you're welcome to do so. You have the obligation to defend the arguments you present, to substantiate any claims you submit with evidence, and to answer direct questions about your ideas posed by other forum members.

[Architect]

Lads,

Lets give him a few hours to see how he responds to the advice re: methods of posting, extent of discussion, etc. before we all rush to knock down his initial posting.

If he's genuinely interested then he'll rise to the challenge. If he's a hit and run CTer, we'll never hear from him again.

I for one hope that it's the former.

[Jon Gold]

My 911Blogger.com Blogs

Pakistan And 9/11
NORAD's Response On 9/11
Sibel Edmonds
The Environmental Impact Of 9/11
The Project For The New American Century
Professor Steven E. Jones
Egos

Would it kill you to take a look?

[R.A.F.]

Would it kill you to take a look?

Will you be presenting any arguments in your own words or will you just be posting links to CT sites??

[AdamT]

Cl1mh4224rd = clueless, brainwashed, and government-propagandized. Out to prove the unsubstanciated and no doubt feeling good in doing so. It will not work. Zlaya is correct, and "banning" him for a week will not stop the truth that 9/11 was an inside job. The king of the debunkers, Popular Mechanics, are running scared as they pump out a new book "debunking" the alternative theories of 9/11. This book is a joke, as is PM. Owned by Hurst Publishing (of Citizen Kane fame), Hurst is the originator of modern yellow journalism. Their research team of <strike>researchers</strike> propagandists consists of none other than Benjamin Chertoff, cousin of DHS head Michael Chertoff (Chertoff means "of the devil" in Russia BTW). 911myths.com is TOTAL disinfo and a means for the sheep to "debunk" 911 Truthers while remaining in their comfort bubble, shielded from the harsh realities of the world. Just think: you learn the truth and might have to actually do something about it! Not that!! Noooooo.....

I dare you to watch these videos.

Watch Loose Change 2nd Edition
Watch TerrorStorm

I dare you to regularly visit these sites.

911Blogger.com
Scholars For 911 Truth
Prison Planet
What Really Happened

I dare you to get a clue.

Only the truth will set you free, not opinions lacking of knowledge.

Note from Cl1mh4224rd:

Perhaps you'd like to note that he was unbanned 4 hours later.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Cl1mh4224rd = clueless, brainwashed, and government-propagandized.

Hmm... Can you refute the picture and snippets of interviews I posted?

CZlaya is correct, and "banning" him for a week will not stop the truth that 9/11 was an inside job.

Perhaps you'd like to note that he was unbanned 4 hours later.

[Wolverine]

AdamT, now would be a really good time for you to carefully study our forum rules.

Ad hominem attacks are prohibited here. If you wish to participate on this forum, you too must abide by our guidelines. If you continue to engage in such behavior, your posting privileges will be suspended or revoked.

As I noted above, Zlaya's suspension was lifted; they are welcome to post here, as noted, abiding by the rules which govern this bulletin board.

[R.A.F.]

I dare you to regularly visit these sites.

Hmmm...that's interesting....regularly?? I've found once to be quite sufficient.

Only the truth will set you free, not opinions lacking of knowledge.

I couldn't have said it better myself...

...clueless, brainwashed...

Now, now...if all you're going to do is call people names, no one will want to play with you...

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Now, now...if all you're going to do is call people names, no one will want to play with you...

What did he say about opinions lacking in knowledge?

[Wolverine]

My 911Blogger.com Blogs

Would it kill you to take a look?

Hello, Jon Gold.

As noted in our ruleset, please be aware that our discussion forum doesn't serve as a vehicle for you to promote your own website or services, and that we have specific guidelines on Hit & Run posting.

You are encouraged to discuss the subject matter here. Is there anything in particular you'd care to address which bears relevance to the thread?

[Sky King]

Will you be presenting any arguments in your own words or will you just be posting links to CT sites??

Doubtful. He's a 9/11 conspiracist on 911Blogger.com who insists that "9/11 was an inside job" but has never made a case for it in his own words. Nor has he responded to challenges.

Perhaps by coming here he is showing a willingness to listen to reason and rational arguements. That would be a welcome change.

[Jon Gold]

Hello, Jon Gold.

As noted in our ruleset, please be aware that our discussion forum doesn't serve as a vehicle for you to promote your own website or services, and that we have specific guidelines on Hit & Run posting.

You are encouraged to discuss the subject matter here. Is there anything in particular you'd care to address which bears relevance to the thread?

As to whether or not 9/11 was an inside job, and the people attempting to debunk the 9/11 Truth Movement are a "joke"?

Sure. 9/11 was orchestrated by elements within our Government, and the people who attempt to "debunk" the 9/11 Truth Movement, are jokes.

[Jon Gold]

Doubtful. He's a 9/11 conspiracist on 911Blogger.com who insists that "9/11 was an inside job" but has never made a case for it in his own words. Nor has he responded to challenges.

Perhaps by coming here he is showing a willingness to listen to reason and rational arguements. That would be a welcome change.

Actually, you can see me make a fool out of Sky King here and here.

[Jon Gold]

Here's a question the "debunkers" can't answer.

Why are we not allowed to question our Government?