The Smell of Moondust

[Fraser]

SUMMARY: When the Apollo astronauts returned to their lunar landers, they all noticed that the moondust - which had clung to their boots and suits - had some interesting properties. For starters, it smelled like spent gunpowder; as if someone had just fired a gun in the lander. Apollo 17's Jack Schmitt came down with a brief case of extraterrestrial hay fever. It could be that the relatively damp interior of the lander causes particles from the solar wind to evaporate into the air.

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[Gerald Lukaniuk]

Odiferous biproducts of black powder can be sulfur dioxide (anhydrous sulfurous acid), sulfur trioxide (anhydrous sulfuric acid), nitric oxide which reacts with oxygen to produce nitrogen trioxide (anhydrous nitric acid) the alkali metal components such as sodium can form sulfides especially if there is more sulfur than charcoal. Sulides and sufites react with some of the above and moisture to produce H2S or rotten egg smell. Hydrides of alkali metals can be produced by high pressure esposure of alkali metal compound with pure hydrogen and have an ozony smell. These things are really bad to breath not to mention combustable. All of the above could exist there due to conditions on the moon. Sulfites trigger allergic reactions in some people. This is arguably proof that at least some astronauts actually went to the moon but has always been a health concern I felt for them.

[Rocketaholic]

How much Moon dust was actually brought back from the moon for study?

[Duane]

I couldn't find a reference to the exact amount of dust/dirt broguht back, but in total, including rocks, ~380kgs of material was returned by the Apollo astronauts with another 150gms of material returned by the Soviet Luna spacecrafts.

[trinitree88]

Odiferous biproducts of black powder can be sulfur dioxide (anhydrous sulfurous acid), sulfur trioxide (anhydrous sulfuric acid), nitric oxide which reacts with oxygen to produce nitrogen trioxide (anhydrous nitric acid) the alkali metal components such as sodium can form sulfides especially if there is more sulfur than charcoal. Sulides and sufites react with some of the above and moisture to produce H2S or rotten egg smell. Hydrides of alkali metals can be produced by high pressure esposure of alkali metal compound with pure hydrogen and have an ozony smell. These things are really bad to breath not to mention combustable. All of the above could exist there due to conditions on the moon. Sulfites trigger allergic reactions in some people. This is arguably proof that at least some astronauts actually went to the moon but has always been a health concern I felt for them.

Interesting.Some of these compounds can also be part and parcel of a supernova blast wave. Hydrogen dominates the chemical composition, but the waves are not homogeneous. Oxides, silicates, sulfides, hydrides all can form, along with metal whiskers, particularly iron. Young supernova remnants, such as Cas A are more appropriately modeled with substantial whisker composition contributing to their spectral characteristics (Dwek, Eli). Though the electrosatic "fountains" of moondust seen at the terminator rattle use of stratigraphic information, chemisorption of gases onto the particles is also an effect of millenia of exposure. Hmm...could be the odor of an 8 million Earth-mass thermonuclear explosion. Now that's a firecracker.

[GBendt]

I donīt think that the smell of fresh moon dust is caused by sulphur deposits originating from nearby supernovae. A supernova is an impressive event, but as the matter of a supermassive star is distributed into space by this, the resulting density of that matter in space becomes extremly low. You can easily calculate it.
I think that radiation from space is the key to the effect. It ionizes atoms and compounds and makes them very reactive. As soon as they are put into an environment where they can react, they react, and you can feel the reaction in your nose if you are on the moon. The high clingyness of moon dust may be caused by this, too.
If a shot is fired, this produces a cloud of ionized atoms and compounds, too, and such this may have a similar effect than fresh moondust.

If we ever go to the moon and build a station from moon dust and rocks there, we have to be prepared to be confronted with unexpected and changing properties of that stuff.

Regards,

Günther

[Duane]

A thought occurs to me--lunans would eventually get used to thes mell ands hardly notice it. When they returned to Earth, they would have a particular odour about them that we Earthlings would notice. I can think of all kinds of nicknames that might arise!

[trinitree88]

[QUOTE=GBendt]I donīt think that the smell of fresh moon dust is caused by sulphur deposits originating from nearby supernovae. A supernova is an impressive event, but as the matter of a supermassive star is distributed into space by this, the resulting density of that matter in space becomes extremly low. You can easily calculate it.

GBendt.It's not just sulfur. The Earth has been dusted with supernova dust a number of times. Iron-60 deposits in marine sediments, ice core samples from Greenland and Antarctica, all show that it rained supernova dust.
The catastrophic 542 AD event seen in all cultures by Michael Baillie of Ireland may have been one too(needs isotopic sampling). The odors can be from chemisorbed surface effects....similar to activated charcoal.
The blast wave (ejecta) does not diffuse over the entire volume, but sweeps it out like an interstellar broom, piling up the sweepings as it goes...like a snowplow.(see Local Bubble,CMB thread)
Moondust contains an unusually high percentage of refractory elements associated with supernova dust, not just lunar meteoritic impact events.
The origin of the hematite covering Mars is easily understood in terms of a rainfall of water and iron oxides from a type2(see other posts). It also explains the observed evidence of Martian water erosion. So, I respectfully disagree. Pete.

[Gerald Lukaniuk]

[QUOTE=trinitree88]

I donīt think that the smell of fresh moon dust is caused by sulphur deposits originating from nearby supernovae. A supernova is an impressive event, but as the matter of a supermassive star is distributed into space by this, the resulting density of that matter in space becomes extremly low. You can easily calculate it.

GBendt.It's not just sulfur. The Earth has been dusted with supernova dust a number of times. Iron-60 deposits in marine sediments, ice core samples from Greenland and Antarctica, all show that it rained supernova dust.
The catastrophic 542 AD event seen in all cultures by Michael Baillie of Ireland may have been one too(needs isotopic sampling). The odors can be from chemisorbed surface effects....similar to activated charcoal.
The blast wave (ejecta) does not diffuse over the entire volume, but sweeps it out like an interstellar broom, piling up the sweepings as it goes...like a snowplow.(see Local Bubble,CMB thread)
Moondust contains an unusually high percentage of refractory elements associated with supernova dust, not just lunar meteoritic impact events.
The origin of the hematite covering Mars is easily understood in terms of a rainfall of water and iron oxides from a type2(see other posts). It also explains the observed evidence of Martian water erosion. So, I respectfully disagree. Pete.

I believe that our sun owes its yellow spectra to the unusual amount of sulfur in its atmosphere and sulfur is quite abundant on earth so why not the moon. I vaguely recall reading some of the analyses of moon rock but I don't remember if they found anything spectacular or exotic about the stuff as I had expected considering anticipated it was millions of years of stuff potentially from vast distances exposed to radiation and ions in preserved in an airless vaccuum. The fact that the dust they supposedly brought home wasn't chemically active like the dust they smelled adds fuel to the theory that some of the moon missions were faked for pr and propaganda reasons because of the extreme cost and danger. We could never understand why moon rocks were so freely given to science centers and banana republics instead of disected down to the last crumb.