Mars Science Laboratory (MSL) - "Curiosity"

[djellison]

So whats going to happen to Opportunity now?

A week or so of down-time (like a solar conjunction) as all the orbital assets are dedicated to Curiosity. But after that - she'll be back to roving and doing science.

[Glom]

I shall watch while playing Motherload, (which is set on Mars)

[Glom]

Uh oh. The pictures are going to be lossy JPEGs which will have artifacts. The conspiracy theorists will have a good time.

[Space Chimp]

Uh oh. The pictures are going to be lossy JPEGs which will have artifacts. The conspiracy theorists will have a good time.

The conspiracy theories would spew mad theories even more if there were no pictures.

There sure are some cynical comments over at the BBC...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-18933037

Sorry,people who support this are all mad. How much was spent on the lunar missions over the years? And what did mankind gain from it? Can we not get our own planet sorted out first?

Who gave NASA the authority to dump more space junk and alarmingly a nuclear device on another planet to fulfill their curiosity?

Why go into space?

[Extravoice]

There will always be the uneducated and the cynical...and worst of all, the uneducated cynical. :-(

[ExplorerAtHeart]

Who gave NASA the authority to dump more space junk and alarmingly a nuclear device on another planet to fulfill their curiosity?

NASA Did.

[djellison]

Actually, launching an RTG requires presidential approval, DOE approval and USAF approval.

NASA simply asked. They did not do so lightly.


And Glom - the early thumbnails will be lossy JPGs. Later imagery can be losslessly compressed if necessary - but an element of compression is necessary for most imagery simple from a bandwidth point of view. This is true for Spirit, Opportunity, Mars Odyssey, MRO, MEX etc etc.

Example - a complete 360 pan with the M100 Mastcam (1200 x 1200 x 24 bit - ie 34 Mbits) would be approx 630 images. Uncompressed that would be more than 20 Gigabits.

The average UHF pass for Spirit and Opportunity is 50 - 100 Mbits. For Curiosity it might be as much as 250 Mbits. It would still take 40 days of downloading nothing but those images to get that panorama down if you don't compress them. It's untenable.

Conspiracists find 'artifacts' in anything. They find it in uncompressed imagery, compressed imagery, raw imagery, calibrated imagery, push broom imagery, framing camera imagery, map projected imagery, un-map projected imagery. They'll find it in ANYTHING. Oh - and here's a prediction. People have been 'finding' things right at the limit of resolution of Pancam on MER ( just like they 'found' things right on the limit of resolution of SSI on Pathfinder.

I'll bet you people 'find things' at the limit of resolution of MastCAM as well. They're always chasing noise. They're not rational.

[Zvezdichko]

Who cares about conspiracy theorists after all? Nobody cares...

[Trebuchet]

Uh oh. The pictures are going to be lossy JPEGs which will have artifacts. The conspiracy theorists will have a good time.

You've just reminded me of some of the discussions on this board when Spirit and Oppy landed. Remember the tiny little alien waving at the camera? And the space bunny, which NASA intentionally crushed under the rover's wheel?

[Strange]

This Phoning Home: Communicating from Mars video explains (in a slightly cheesy way) how the initial data confirming landing will be received (via Odyssey or the Reconnaissance Orbiter). It says (at about 2'0'') that it will take "several hours" to decode the data.

Why so long? Or do they mean the time to receive the data (I assume it is a pretty low bandwidth link)?

[Zvezdichko]

This video also explains that we may not hear about the rover for THREE DAYS in the worst case...

[ugordan]

It says (at about 2'0'') that it will take "several hours" to decode the data.

Only the MRO data will have to go through that lengthy decoding process once it's played back to Earth, MODY data will be decoded in real time. That's could be due to the way MRO will transmit the (recorded) MSL carrier signal and telemetry. For example, MRO might relay that data encapsulated inside its own telemetry stream and the DSN can readily unpack only this first layer.

[mutleyeng]

JPL always try to tone down expectations.
Its like Scotty, doubling how long he says it will take to fix the engines.

[swampyankee]

JPL always try to tone down expectations.
Its like Scotty, doubling how long he says it will take to fix the engines.

They've had a lot of practice with budget people, who think there is 20% waste in everything except their bonus checks.

[R.A.F.]

Who cares about conspiracy theorists after all? Nobody cares...

Would it not be more precise for you to say that you don't care?

I know my opinion differs...



edit to add....personally, I can't wait to see that first image...it's gonna be beautiful.

[Zvezdichko]

I clearly remember the first image from Spirit. It had some bluish hue when it was first published

[djellison]

I clearly remember the first image from Spirit. It had some bluish hue when it was first published

The first image from Spirit was Black and White - if you remember it having a bluish hue, that is nothing to do with the vehicle, its cameras or its environments. The first color image, a few sols later, clearly had no blue hue

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/galle...20040106c.html

[Jeyawati]

Who cares about conspiracy theorists after all? Nobody cares...

Stupid people are more inclined to side with conspiracy theorists than the truth.

[Zvezdichko]

Yes, I think it was probably secondarily photographed from a TV screen and then reuploaded on the NASA/JPL website and this prolly explained the bluish hue. Then this photo was deleted and reuploaded again with no hue. I know what I'm talking about - not talking about color photos or 3D photos

[mutleyeng]

Fair winds Curiosity
Good luck JPL

[Strange]

Only the MRO data will have to go through that lengthy decoding process

I'm wondering why the decoding process is so lengthy. Is it because they use a highly asymmetrical compression algorithm to save computing cycles and power on the transmitting end?

[ugordan]

I'm wondering why the decoding process is so lengthy. Is it because they use a highly asymmetrical compression algorithm to save computing cycles and power on the transmitting end?

I think it's because MRO just records a raw radio signal and that generates a huge volume of data, i.e. not 1s and 0s of data that MSL is actually sending. That, then needs to be downlinked to Earth and the MSL carrier signal plucked out of that raw recording and then the telemetry demultiplexed off of that carrier signal.

Or something of the sort.

[BetaDust]

i'll second this:

Fair winds Curiosity
Good luck JPL

Have a great entry descent and landing Curiosity!

-- Dennis

[Sticks]

I will not be watching, in case that causes it to crash aka Schroedinger's Cat

[djellison]

I think it's because MRO just records a raw radio signal and that generates a huge volume of data, i.e. not 1s and 0s of data that MSL is actually sending. That, then needs to be downlinked to Earth and the MSL carrier signal plucked out of that raw recording and then the telemetry demultiplexed off of that carrier signal.

Or something of the sort.

You're exactly right. MRO is recording in canister mode. It doesn't lock on to MSL- it just records everything at its frequency. THat massive recording takes a few hours to download, an hour or so to generate a waterfall plot, and another hour or so to pull the data out of.

It's the most reliable, robust way of getting every single bit of data that MSL might send. The upside of the Odyssey link is the real-time nature. The downside is that it's more sensitive to drop-outs etc.

[Strange]

Ah, got it. Thanks.

[Zvezdichko]

I am personally very excited. Last night I almost couldn't sleep and I was dreaming heat shield separations and parachute deployments all the time... again, and again and again

Going to bed soon and I pray that I will wake up no earlier than 2 hours before landing.

[R.A.F.]

....I almost couldn't sleep and I was dreaming heat shield separations and parachute deployments...

I have every confidence in JPL, and it's abilities to carry out this mission.

I'm more "concerned" about variables we can do nothing about....such as landing on a boulder.


edit to add...."concerned" is too strong a word...let's just say I am nervous.

[suntrack2]

congratulations for the another leg on mars "curiocity-mars lander"
sunil.

[absael]

Hey everybody, I haven't posted here in a while, but I wanted to check in because I knew that you guys would have some good info on Curiosity. I wasn't disappointed

I will not be watching, in case that causes it to crash aka Schroedinger's Cat

I had a similar (well, somewhat similar) thought yesterday when watching a NASA news conference, in which one of the scientists mentioned the 14 light minute distance to Mars. Since we won't get a signal telling us the outcome of the landing for that period of time, it's almost as if the rover will be in an indeterminate state until the 14 minutes has elapsed and we can observe it.

I'll be listening to the coverage and hoping for the best. This will be a huge achievement for NASA if it goes well.