Emergency escape system too dangerous to test

[BigJim]

Did anybody find this as ridiculous as I did:
http://www.space.com/missionlaunches...ng_041203.html

NASA deemed a test of its emergency slidewire escape system too risky. Somtimes I wonder how these guys think:
"Hey Ed, what if the external fuel tank explodes?"
"Well, Ned, we've developed an emergency escape system for that possiblity."
"Great! Can we have the astronauts test it?"
"Nah. It's too dangerous."
"Oh. OK."

I'm thinking of ejection seats and their related hazards. I guess you could make the case that ejections seats are life-savers but fairly dangerous, and not something that you'd want to use unless you really had to, and that the slide-wire is similar. But still, the sheer irony of an emergency system that's there to improve safety being too dangerous to use...

[Doodler]

"Fate, it seems, is not without a sense of irony."

Somehow, I think this sums up what would otherwise be a tirade of legendary proportions. Even the old B-70 Valkyrie's ejection system, even with it's EXTREMELY experimental nature, was tested.

[kucharek]

We don't test car safety systems (belts, airbags) with real people. Today, we have dummies, which provide much more data to the engineers than a strapped-in human being. Life-safing systems are no guarantee that you survive unhurt, they just help you not being killed. So why risk hurting people when a dummy can do the same.

[Bozola]

We don't test car safety systems (belts, airbags) with real people. Today, we have dummies, which provide much more data to the engineers than a strapped-in human being. Life-safing systems are no guarantee that you survive unhurt, they just help you not being killed. So why risk hurting people when a dummy can do the same.

No one rode down the slidewires during the drill. NASA safety officials deemed that an unnecessary risk.

Exactly - the operative phrase here is "unnecessary risk".

[Captain Kidd]

I can think of a few other (non-shuttle) safety systems that are intended as last-staw activities. Once they're activated, say goodby to that piece of equipment ever being operated again. So testing can't always be recommended for everything.

[ToSeek]

Did anybody find this as ridiculous as I did:
http://www.space.com/missionlaunches...ng_041203.html

NASA deemed a test of its emergency slidewire escape system too risky. Somtimes I wonder how these guys think:
"Hey Ed, what if the external fuel tank explodes?"
"Well, Ned, we've developed an emergency escape system for that possiblity."
"Great! Can we have the astronauts test it?"
"Nah. It's too dangerous."
"Oh. OK."

I'm thinking of ejection seats and their related hazards. I guess you could make the case that ejections seats are life-savers but fairly dangerous, and not something that you'd want to use unless you really had to, and that the slide-wire is similar. But still, the sheer irony of an emergency system that's there to improve safety being too dangerous to use...

I think you're misinterpreting the significance of the drill. This was to test the people and procedures engaged in the rescue, not every element of the mechanics. I believe that the slideware system has been tested numerous times (I've seen documentaries showing this). There was no point in doing so during this drill because it wasn't an essential element, and it is, of course, risky.

[sts60]

Exactly. The slidewire system has been tested; there was no need to go down them for this drill.

I don't, however, remember them being big enough for four people as the article said. I seem to remember them being for one person each (7 baskets for a maximum of seven crewmembers). :-k

As for
"Hey Ed, what if the external fuel tank explodes?"
"Well, Ned, we've developed an emergency escape system for that possiblity."
Well, if the ET explodes, you don't have to worry much about the slidewire system anyway. Most of your component molecules would get away from the pad much faster than 55 mph. :P

[Swift]

I can think of a few other (non-shuttle) safety systems that are intended as last-staw activities. Once they're activated, say goodby to that piece of equipment ever being operated again. So testing can't always be recommended for everything.

That reminds me of an old Calvin and Hobbes cartoon. Calvin and his mom and dad are driving around. They cross a bridge with a weight limit sign. Calvin asks his dad how they determine the weight limit. His dad says they drive bigger and bigger trucks over the bridge till it breaks; they know the weight of the biggest truck, so they know the limit. They then rebuild the bridge. #-o

[Captain Kidd]

Hehe, I read that one again last night. (My wife's a big Calvin and Hobbes nut and owns most of the books.)

[Nicolas]

No one rode down the slidewires during the drill. NASA safety officials deemed that an unnecessary risk.

That is something slightly different from not testing it because it is too risky. As said in this thread, it was a general simulation, not a slide test.

Even the old B-70 Valkyrie's ejection system, even with it's EXTREMELY experimental nature, was tested.

Too bad it failed for one person, and nearly for another during the XB-70 crash... (the first one couldn't close the capsule, teh second one got his arm trapped in the cockpit at first, and only ejected at very low altitude. He survived because he broke through his chair, reducing the deceleration force)

I don't, however, remember them being big enough for four people as the article said.

If you look at what space capsules they designed for 2 astronauts, I think they can get 4 into the baskets too The picture next to the article shows at least 2 persons sitting in a basket.



If the fuel tanks really explodes, I think the slides are of little use indeed. Obviously they are designed as a help in somewhat smaller disasters

[01101001]

I don't, however, remember them being big enough for four people as the article said. I seem to remember them being for one person each (7 baskets for a maximum of seven crewmembers).

They have to be for more than a shuttle crewful. There might be other workers up there when things go wrong.

CNN shuttle-safety article:

They would find themselves on a platform a dizzying 195 feet above the ground. To one side they would find a row of seven tubular steel baskets wrapped in a fire-retardant material called Nomex. Each basket is fastened to a stout cable slanting down and away toward the ground. These "slide-wire baskets," in NASA terminology, are the low-tech "escape vehicles" for the astronauts and any members of the close-out crew still on the site who don't mind making an exit with Hollywood overtones. Each basket can hold three people comfortably, four in a pinch.