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Thread: What constellation was 500 AD breakup of comet Encke fragment seen in?

  1. #1

    What constellation was 500 AD breakup of comet Encke fragment seen in?

    Fred Whipple noted in 1950 that a large meteor in the Taurid stream broke apart around 500 AD and that this fragment itself had broken off of the parent comet around 2300 BC.

    Since he was able to backtrack the orbit of the fragments to see when they had last coincided with the giant fragment and when the giant fragment had last coincided with the parent, would it be possible to know what constellation(s) in the night sky these events would have been visible in?

    Has anyone actually done the calculation and (fingers crossed) by chance is this data available to download into Stellarium so we can watch it for ourselves?

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    I expect that the breakups would have occured while the
    comet was close to the Sun, so it would have been moving
    relatively rapidly through the sky, perhaps passing through
    several constellations in a single month. The times of the
    breakups can probably only be determined to within plus
    or minus a few decades.

    The comet and the bits that come from it are small enough
    to be pushed around significantly by outgassing, so their
    orbits change unpredictably. That makes the fragments
    spread apart. The centerline of the cloud of fragments is
    not necessarily where the comet's orbit originally was.

    -- Jeff, in Minneapolis
    http://www.FreeMars.org/jeff/

    "I find astronomy very interesting, but I wouldn't if I thought we
    were just going to sit here and look." -- "Van Rijn"

    "The other planets? Well, they just happen to be there, but the
    point of rockets is to explore them!" -- Kai Yeves

  3. #3
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    If you know that Whipple noted that in the 1950s then you may also have a source which might lead you to something published.

    Also ADS is your friend:
    here is a list of Whipple's papers from 1950 to 1960
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  4. #4
    Here's a linke to the paper where I found the information about the breakup:

    "On the Origin of the Taurid Meteors." Fred Whipple

    I assume that the fragments he was writing about in 1950 are still out there and their orbital information included in the JPL database? How would I find this info since the article doesn't really identify the fragments he was researching? But he does note:

    "We propose tentatively that the violent ejections from Comet Encke and its possible companion(s?) were the result of encounters with small asteroidal bodies, since the suggested points of ejection lie near the plane of the asteroids and the earlier one near the region of their greatest concentration. The deviations in q and Q of the meteor orbits from the present ellipse of Comet Encke permit the calculation of the velocity vectors in the first nencounter. The derived directions and velocities of the ejected meteoroids are entirely consistent with the encounter hypothesis if the asteroid moved in a nearly circular orbit."
    I would love to put all these objects in Stellarium along with Encke and just watch for myself when they coincided with Encke and see where in the sky this happened.
    Last edited by gdaniels99; 2012-Aug-16 at 04:58 PM.

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