1991 "candidate alien artifact"?

[MAPNUT]

http://articles.adsabs.harvard.edu/c...;filetype=.pdf

I came across this on Reddit. Might there be anything to it, or just speculation? The article, by Duncan Steel, seems to conclude that "alien artifact" is the most likely explanation to the variable appearance of a small object that passed by Earth in 1991. I'd be surprised if this hasn't been discussed before, but a search on "Duncan Steel" didn't turn up anything. (I didn't read the whole article.)

[Soullless49er]

The article looks to be academically inclined and well-researched, well at least in regards to the woo-woo I usually find about possible alien artifacts on the UFO sites I've visited before.

And the logical conclusions reached through their analysis does indeed look like it is most likely to be something artificial but not man-made - and thus alien.

Is there anyway this object could be found again and one day retrieved? Didn't the authors and astronomical researchers say it periodically come backs toward the Earth or not?

If it was found, recovered and really did turn out to be an alien artifact, what sorts of knowledge do you think could be unraveled from it? Could the origin of who made it be determined?

I would really like to read some thoughts and opinions on this article, as in greater scrutiny. Does anyone else think this could have really been the holy grail - an actual alien artifact in our solar system?

[eburacum45]

Here's a Wiki page about the object.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_VG

It will make another close approach to earth in 2017.

It might be artificial; but it need not be extraterrestrial. Here's another artificial 'asteroid' which has been positively identified
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J002E3

Further examination revealed the object was not a rock asteroid but instead the S-IVB third stage of the Apollo 12 Saturn V rocket (serial S-IVB-507).

and another possible example
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6Q0B44E

Similarities between the discoveries of B44E and J002E3, now believed to be part of the Apollo 12 rocket, have led some astronomers to speculate that B44E may be another relic of human space exploration which has returned to Earth orbit.

[JCoyote]

It does put a question in my head: What if our first encounter with an extraterrestrial civilization is literally finding a piece of their trash?

A left over rocket booster or some such that was gravitationally flung out of another solar system millions of years ago?

Approached objectively, how much could one of our old boosters tell an alien culture about us a million years later?

[Usher]

It does put a question in my head: What if our first encounter with an extraterrestrial civilization is literally finding a piece of their trash?

A left over rocket booster or some such that was gravitationally flung out of another solar system millions of years ago?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rendezvous_with_Rama

"Rendezvous with Rama is a novel by Arthur C. Clarke first published in 1972. Set in the 22nd century, the story involves a fifty-kilometre-long (31 miles) cylindrical alien starship that enters Earth's solar system. The story is told from the point of view of a group of human explorers, who intercept the ship in an attempt to unlock its mysteries..."

While involving more than "trash" (or not?), Clarke imagined a similar encounter.

[eburacum45]

I think that 'finding a piece of their trash' is quite possibly the first evidence we will find of extraterrestrial intelligence. If their trash can persist for billions of years, and if they have ever visited our Solar System within its lifetime, then all we need to do is find the evidence. Probably like looking for one needle in a million haystacks.

[Luckmeister]

I think that 'finding a piece of their trash' is quite possibly the first evidence we will find of extraterrestrial intelligence. If their trash can persist for billions of years, and if they have ever visited our Solar System within its lifetime, then all we need to do is find the evidence. Probably like looking for one needle in a million haystacks.

I doubt that it would be productive to go out "looking" for an alien artifact, unless we had some idea where to look, but if one comes close and we discover it, that would be incredible. First we would analyze the heck out of it's composition, including age-dating (if possible) and then attempt to trace its trajectory back as far as we could. We would definitely want to know if it was from beyond our solar system. Thinking about where it possibly came from would be very exciting and maybe very frustrating.

[Soullless49er]

Do you think the object discussed in the article is that 'needle in a million haystacks?'

[Luckmeister]

Do you think the object discussed in the article is that 'needle in a million haystacks?'

Not likely.

[R.A.F.]

Does anyone else think this could have really been the holy grail - an actual alien artifact in our solar system?

Without more conclusive evidence, the answer is no.

[baskerbosse]

Do I think this could be an alien artifact? -No.

There seems to be three alternatives:

Natural object: Unlikely
Man made object: Unlikely
Alien made object: Unlikely

Still, it has to be one of the three.
All unlikely, none impossible.

To me, the third alternative seems the most unlikely of the three.
Helios I booster maybe.. -A very strange asteroid??
Someone needs to go and have a look.. -What's Bruce Willis doing at the moment? ;-)


Peter

[Bad Ronald]

While I hope & would love this object to really be from real aliens as that would be the most important event ever, let's take a step back. No one mentioned the suspected alien object of possibly being a piece of Soviet spacecraft that went awry.

I'd like nothing more than for this object to be of intelligent extraterrestrial origin, but unfortunately it's more likely refuse from American or Russian space exploration.

I'm not trying to be bubble bursting or parade drenching.

[kzb]

A good deal of Western nations' stuff up there is classified, not to speak of USSR and other nations.

Isotopic ratios: the ratios of certain elements isotopes to each other have the potential to trace the stellar system in which the artifact was built. This is because those isotope ratios can be measured in the star from here.

[Anthrage]

I would suggest reading this as well, rather interesting and amusing.

[Access Denied]

It might be artificial; but it need not be extraterrestrial.

I meant to post this earlier and forgot but for what it’s worth, somebody brought this up at RU earlier this year and I decided to do a little research and discovered that pending repeated observations (63 as of that writing), terrestrial (human) origin, ET origin, and finally Earth-Moon origin has systematically been rejected as unlikely after further independent analysis as detailed in subsequent publications as follows...

An Asteroid in a Earth-like Orbit
Tancredi, G.
Celestial Mechanics and Dynamical Astronomy, v. 69, Issue 1/2, p. 119-132 (1997).
http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1997CeMDA..69..119T

The dynamical evolution of an asteroid with orbital elements strikingly similar to the Earth is analysed. The object, 1991 VG, was discovered by the Spacewatch telescope during a particular encounter with the planet. 1991 VG experienced a temporary satellite capture by the Earth, a phenomena that is recurrent in its dynamical history. The possible origin of this puzzling object is discussed, including the suggestion that 1991 VG could be a piece of lunar ejecta after a great impact.

Tancredi cites Steel's low probability of detection argument against terrestrial (human) origin and presents his case for Earth-Moon origin however this too has since been rejected...

Asteroids on Earth-like orbits and their origin
Brasser, R.; Wiegert, P.
Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society, Volume 386, Issue 4, pp. 2031-2038 (2008).
http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2008MNRAS.386.2031B

The orbit of 1991 VG and a set of other asteroids whose orbits are very similar to that of the Earth have been examined. Its origin has been speculated to be a returning spacecraft, lunar ejecta or a low-inclination Amor- or Apollo-class object. The latter is arguably the more likely source, which has been investigated here. The impact probability for these objects has been calculated, and while it is larger than that of a typical near-Earth asteroid (NEA), it is still less than 1:200000 over the next 5000 yr. In addition, the probability of an NEA ever ending up on an Earth-like orbit has been obtained from numerical simulations and turned out to be about 1:20000, making this a rare class of objects. The typical time spent in this state is about 10000 yr, much less than the typical NEA lifetime of 10 Myr.

If you go to the JPL Small-Body Database Browser page, you can see it has been provisionally classified as an Apollo [NEO] object…

(1991 VG)
http://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/sbdb.cgi?sstr=1991%20VG;orb=1

[not to be confused with the Apollo program]

[AbsherL]

Do I think this could be an alien artifact? -No.

There seems to be three alternatives:

Natural object: Unlikely
Man made object: Unlikely
Alien made object: Unlikely

Still, it has to be one of the three.
All unlikely, none impossible.

To me, the third alternative seems the most unlikely of the three.
Helios I booster maybe.. -A very strange asteroid??
Someone needs to go and have a look.. -What's Bruce Willis doing at the moment? ;-)


Peter

yeah, All we have these 3 suggestions. That's true. But the Question is where is the evidence to prove all these?

[Rhaedas]

yeah, All we have these 3 suggestions. That's true. But the Question is where is the evidence to prove all these?

We have only what we have. The one key is that we know it will make another nearby pass in 2017, and then we'll likely get more details that will help answer what exactly it is.

I would bet though it's a 50/50 odds on the first two options.

[ravens_cry]

Natural object? I grade that likely. Man-made object? Probable, it has happened before, as mentioned earlier in the thread.
I must admit the possibility of it being of extraterrestrial origin is quite exciting however.
If it were, it would not only mean that their at least has been other intelligences out there, but they also developed space technology. Even if it is the equivalent of space junk, it would mean other minds have looked up into the sky and thought "What's out there?"
And that is a very special thought.

[Githyanki]

I don't think there's a person here on BAUT that doesn't want it to be an "Alien-probe", but in reality, it's probably either space-junk or an asteroid we took faulty readings from.

[Gomar]

cylindrical alien starship that enters Earth's solar system. The story is told from the point of view of a group of human explorers, who intercept the ship in an attempt to unlock its mysteries..."

While involving more than "trash" (or not?), Clarke imagined a similar encounter.

Sounds too much like 2001. Or an extended version of it. An alien artifact buried on the Moon to await being dug up by any intelligence on Earth.
Ifcourse, if such artifacts did exist, they would've been found a long time ago. It's not hard for alien probes to take over Earth's radio and TV broadcasts to signal their presence. No alien signals = no alien probes or ships exist in the solar system.

[ravens_cry]

Sounds too much like 2001. Or an extended version of it. An alien artifact buried on the Moon to await being dug up by any intelligence on Earth.
Ifcourse, if such artifacts did exist, they would've been found a long time ago. It's not hard for alien probes to take over Earth's radio and TV broadcasts to signal their presence. No alien signals = no alien probes or ships exist in the solar system.

Would we be able to detect a laser used to transmit data if it was pointed directly at the intended receiver? They could use signal lamps if they only transmitted on the side of bodies pointing away from us, our own presence being painfully obvious. Hiding a thermal signature is harder, but the argument against stealth in space by directional emission on this page assume both sides are fully space travellers and have seeded their solar system with sensors to view all angles. Maybe its their version of the Prime Directive "If you can see us, you are ready to see us". Or maybe not, who knows.
The scenario also assumes it is a working artefact, when even a piece of space junk of extraterrestrial origin would be an amazing find.
I am not saying any of this is true, but it is fun to play the advocatus diaboli.

[kzb]

When you think the galaxy should've been explored and colonised about a billion years ago, finding relics should be about the most likely evidence we are likely to find.

Will a billion-year old civilisation still send out probes and communicate by radio? Probably not, but they may have left stuff lying around from when they were more primitive.