Science Fiction, Fantasy and Alternate History Stories

[solitonmanny]

Greetings to all carbon based, bipedal water bags residing on the third mudball,

There have been many books over the last few years presuming to ask the basic "what if?" question as regards to human history...what if aliens attempted to land during the second world war...what if .. many scenarios too many to count easily.

What about using real history to suggest that certain historical figures actually met and introduced advances in technology based on the prevailing levels of achievement.

For example...Babbage meets a decent watchmaker to reduce the size of his computaional machine...in so doing he meets other engineers and is introduced to the concept of mass production...you try to build a Babbage Machine utilising watch parts by yourself!

What about all the other figures in our history who could have met and really changed our shared history.
Best wishes to all and take care,

Manny
The Newbie

[tashirosgt]

The real ideas in stories aren't their plots. People's fondness for literature that has an original plot is probably due to how well the writer executed the plot, not the plot itself. Charles Babbage meets watchmaker written by Willian Faulkner might have been an interesting piece of literature. Why not add that "what if" to the mix? What if a talented author had taken a screwy plot and produced a geat story?

[Dgennero]

Well...
IF either
a.) the universe is infinite OR
b.) there are an infinite number of parallel worlds
THEN
anything you can think of is real - somewhere.
In one of those universes you are supreme lord of the earth.
In another one, I am having a pangalactic gargleblaster.
Oops - that's this one

[HenrikOlsen]

I've seen this before.
There's nothing in the existence of an infinite universe that means everything that can be thought of exists somewhere in it.

[Paul Beardsley]

I've seen this before.
There's nothing in the existence of an infinite universe that means everything that can be thought of exists somewhere in it.

Agreed. There still has to be a reason for the thought-of thing to happen. It's trivially easy to imagine a scenario that would never come to pass.

[solitonmanny]

Greetings all,

I suggested a tentative scenario based (loosely) on the premise of actual historical figures within our universe/reality (this is meandering into areas beyond simple cosmology...anyone for multiverse theory?), amazing how a simple question can generate so many sidetracks of thought that are not even vaguely related to the original post.

It is a simple matter really since many of the historical figures in our collective past did communicate, unfortunately they did not engage upon certain areas which we could postulate only because we have the benefit of hindsight.

It could be a waste of time or it could be fun, you can determine wether the outcome justifies the effort.


Best to all and take care,

Manny
The Newbie

[KaiYeves]

So you mean, hypothetical historical team-ups? Darn it, I can't think of any examples off the top of my head, but I get what you mean. "What if X and Y had worked together to do Z" and that sort of thing, right?

[vonmazur]

What if William Burroughs instead of Edgar Rice Burroughs wrote Tarzan??? "Jungle Rot Kid On the Nod" by the late Phillip Jose Farmer....Hard to find this short story and I do not know where on the net it is....very funny and too much bad taste to relate here..

Dale

[Graybeard6]

So you mean, hypothetical historical team-ups? Darn it, I can't think of any examples off the top of my head, but I get what you mean. "What if X and Y had worked together to do Z" and that sort of thing, right?

How about The Two Georges by Harry Turtledove and Richard Dreyfuss? Yes, the actor. GW and G III signed a peace treaty, the US became part of the British Commonwealth, so no expulsion of Loyalists, no War of 1812 or Civil War, and a peaceful end to slavery.

[solitonmanny]

Greetings to all,

Yes to KaiYeves' reply and question and a tentative yes to vonmazur's reply, although I must point out that I was thinking more along the lines of the possible technology outcome from these hypothetical meetings and the possible changes in the then societies in which these "advanced technologies" were instituted.

The possibilities are indeed many and varied although to be fair some of the more outrageous connections I've thought of may be a bit much to take in, so I shall keep to the sensible, middle of the road connections...at another time.

Best to all and take care,

Manny
The Newbie

[ravens_cry]

How about The Two Georges by Harry Turtledove and Richard Dreyfuss? Yes, the actor. GW and G III signed a peace treaty, the US became part of the British Commonwealth, so no expulsion of Loyalists, no War of 1812 or Civil War, and a peaceful end to slavery.

Here's a wonderment I have never seen brought up, what if Quebec had joined with the American revolutionaries and became the 14th state? Unfortunatly, I do not know enough about history to say myself, but it's a thought.
One thing I don't like about Turtledove is his stories tend to be a bit too parallel.
For example, when the South lost the equivalent to World War 1, there was an obvious analogue to Hitler character. It's like Turtledove was saying "See? See how clever I was there?", which can be an irritating.

[tnjrp]

There's nothing in the existence of an infinite universe that means everything that can be thought of exists somewhere in it.

An infinite universe (or a multiverse, if you prefer) should, according to people who are better at math that I am, have everything that can possibly happen happen in it at some point. Counterintuitive tho it seems. Obviously this is not the same thing as everything that can be thought to happen.

As to the original post, such stories indeed abound and there are even serious scientific efforts towards determining alt-history outcomes but it's IMCO very difficult to settle for a single most plausible one from such an event. The inherently chaotic nature of interactions rather ensures that the further away one progresses from the event in time the more convoluted the skein of propable/possible events will become.

[Paul Beardsley]

What if William Burroughs instead of Edgar Rice Burroughs wrote Tarzan??? "Jungle Rot Kid On the Nod" by the late Phillip Jose Farmer....Hard to find this short story and I do not know where on the net it is....very funny and too much bad taste to relate here..

Dale

(My bold.)

It is included in Riverworld and Other Stories. There appear to be copies available on Amazon.

[HenrikOlsen]

An infinite universe (or a multiverse, if you prefer) should, according to people who are better at math that I am, have everything that can possibly happen happen in it at some point. Counterintuitive tho it seems. Obviously this is not the same thing as everything that can be thought to happen.

Yep, everything with a non-zero probability will happen infinitely many times in an infinite universe.
It's possible to think of things with a zero probability.

[grant hutchison]

(My bold.)

It is included in Riverworld and Other Stories. There appear to be copies available on Amazon.

Also in a themed collection of short stories edited by Ellen Datlow: Alien Sex. Second-hand copies are very cheap.

Grant Hutchison

[KaiYeves]

I thought of this one in class today- what if Tesla teamed up with the makers of the early electric cars in the 1900s and made better batteries so that they could drive longer distances? Suppose they continued to surpass gasoline-fueled models of the period instead of being overtaken in performance?

[HenrikOlsen]

I thought of this one in class today- what if Tesla teamed up with the makers of the early electric cars in the 1900s and made better batteries so that they could drive longer distances? Suppose they continued to surpass gasoline-fueled models of the period instead of being overtaken in performance?

Tesla was the master of the alternating current, batteries were not really his main forte.

[Disinfo Agent]

Yes to KaiYeves' reply and question and a tentative yes to vonmazur's reply, although I must point out that I was thinking more along the lines of the possible technology outcome from these hypothetical meetings and the possible changes in the then societies in which these "advanced technologies" were instituted.

That seems to describe the content of much historical fiction.

[vonmazur]

(My bold.)

It is included in Riverworld and Other Stories. There appear to be copies available on Amazon.

Yes, Thanks, that is where I got it recently. At one time I had memorized the whole thing...a stupid adventure for sure, but it helps the memory to exercise it one in a while...........

Dale

[vonmazur]

Tesla was the master of the alternating current, batteries were not really his main forte.

Sorry I cannot help it; "Batteries? we don't need no stinkin' Batteries..."

Dale

[mugaliens]

What if, in 1904, the U.S. Patent Office had not awarded Guglielmo Marconi the patent for radio? What if Tesla's Means For Increasing The Intensity of Electrical Oscillations (Oct 22, 1901) had nudged Marconi's efforts to the sidelines? What if Tesla had not waived Westinghouse's contracts and had become the world's first billionaire?

[Ara Pacis]

What if Hitler hadn't hated Jews and had met Einstein...