Magnetic Monopole a certainty?

[thoth II]

"Monopole detection is an open problem in experimental physics. Within theoretical physics, some modern approaches assume their existence. Joseph Polchinski, a prominent string-theorist, described the existence of monopoles as "one of the safest bets that one can make about physics not yet seen."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_monopole

Look at the table in that article, one shows Maxwell's equations today, and one with the introduction of magnetic monopoles. Obviously, there must be monopoles because that makes the equations symmetric. So they must be there, but they just are not detected. Does anyone know of any experiments that they are going to do soon to try to detect these?

[Digix]

Scientists try to find monopoles for ages already, but no success. It looks same hopeless stuff like perpetual motion engine or Highs boson.

Detection experiments (besides old ones that attempted to fish these monopoles with magnets everywhere, if the book I read was correct there were attempts to fish monopoles on the moon too during some Apollo mission ) are usual: smashing particles in accelerators.
Still no monopoles appeared, but as always physicists just say that hammer was too small, and promise definite appearance when new smasher will be built.
Now some have big hopes for LHC

I think, monopoles cannot exist, because magnetic field itself is just side effect of electric field.
If monopoles are stable as predicted there should be quite a lot of them in universe and they are quite easy to detect, but still nothing is found.

[tusenfem]

I think, monopoles cannot exist, because magnetic field itself is just side effect of electric field.



Digix, please keep to mainstream physics with your "answers."
Magnetic and electric fields are manifestations of the electromagnetic field.




If monopoles are stable as predicted there should be quite a lot of them in universe and they are quite easy to detect, but still nothing is found.

Why would there be quite a lot of them? They are expected to be very massive (larger than 600 GeV/c2)and if I am not mistaken, cosmology theories deal quite well with the disappearance of the primordial monopoles, and their number should be quite low in the universe.

[DrRocket]

"Monopole detection is an open problem in experimental physics. Within theoretical physics, some modern approaches assume their existence. Joseph Polchinski, a prominent string-theorist, described the existence of monopoles as "one of the safest bets that one can make about physics not yet seen."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_monopole

Look at the table in that article, one shows Maxwell's equations today, and one with the introduction of magnetic monopoles. Obviously, there must be monopoles because that makes the equations symmetric. So they must be there, but they just are not detected. Does anyone know of any experiments that they are going to do soon to try to detect these?

There are theoretical reasons why one might expect monopoles to exist. One of the strongest is due to Dirac who showed that the existence of even one monopole, somewhere in the universe, would imply the quantization of electric charge. Without that the quantization of charge is simply an observed fact, with no more basic reason.

On the other hand, experimenters have been looking for monopoles for decades without the slightest hint of one.

You can find a discussion of the question of monopoles in J.D. Jackson's Classical Electrodynamics.

As it stands mainstream theory does not include monopoles and the usual form of Maxwell's equations basically forbids them. But that is a reflection of what has been seen experimentally. I doubt anyone would be shocked if monopoles were eventually discovered, but it would be a major big deal. In the meantime the internet is flooded with wackos who claim to be able to show the existence of monopoles by, for instance, cutting a magnet in half -- and that is, of course, utter nonsense.

[Digix]

"Weakly Interacting Massive Particles" that have comparable mass to monopoles are hypothetical candidates for dark matter so if these particles are so common why monopoles should be rare?
Everything depends on stability of these particles, if they are stable as expected, and if there is hope to produce them in LHC lots of then should be formed in the beginning of universe.

Also energy of 600Gev is just based on fact that older colliers cannot produce monopoles, and I believe after LHC will fail this energy will be lifter to 14Gev and so it will go up indefinitely.

[thoth II]

wackos who claim to be able to show the existence of monopoles by, for instance, cutting a magnet in half -- and that is, of course, utter nonsense.

Yeah, because then you just get two smaller dipoles, but dipoles nevertheless.

[L Wippler]

Yeah, because then you just get two smaller dipoles, but dipoles nevertheless.

Monopoles obey the law of attraction. If you wish to separate north and south monopoles, you have to use a dipole. If you move the north pole of a dipole past a coil of wire, you will attract all the south monopoles in the same direction, the opposite will happen using the south pole of a dipole. This is how electricity is generated by separating monopoles, recombine these monopoles and you get a magnetic field.

[DrRocket]

Monopoles obey the law of attraction. If you wish to separate north and south monopoles, you have to use a dipole. If you move the north pole of a dipole past a coil of wire, you will attract all the south monopoles in the same direction, the opposite will happen using the south pole of a dipole. This is how electricity is generated by separating monopoles, recombine these monopoles and you get a magnetic field.

Rubbish. Not just wrong. Most certainly ATM.

As I recall you have some serious questions that remain unanswered in the ATM forum.

[John Jaksich]

Dear L Wippler,

Take heed of Dr. Rocket's advice---as well as his previous posts in this thread.

Through the Laws of Electromagnetism--- the existence of magnetic monopoles are strictly forbidden. Unless you have some insight into cutting edge theory that can disprove the assertions of Electromagnetism--then "try to prove it in a scientifc manner rather than through tautology"

[captain swoop]

Digix and L Wippler
This Forum is for questions on the Mainstream of Science and answers are restricted to the Mainstream of Science. If you post your own ideas and ATM claims you will run into trouble. Restrict yourself to Mainstream answers. IF you don't know or aren't sure then ask a question.

[L Wippler]

Dear L Wippler,

Take heed of Dr. Rocket's advice---as well as his previous posts in this thread.

Through the Laws of Electromagnetism--- the existence of magnetic monopoles are strictly forbidden. Unless you have some insight into cutting edge theory that can disprove the assertions of Electromagnetism--then "try to prove it in a scientifc manner rather than through tautology"

The laws of Electromagnetism are incorrect, the law of attraction is correct, monopoles obey this law, look at the end result. (please use common sense)

[astromark]

The laws of Electromagnetism are incorrect, the law of attraction is correct, monopoles obey this law, look at the end result. (please use common sense)

'The laws of electromagnetism are (NOT) incorrect. and please use common sense' do not fit well together... If you want to be taken seriously you need to give a sound reason for this assertion. If I drop my spanner across the poles of a battery...ZAP ! thats a fact., and a good well reasoned argument of FACTS are known and well understood. You can not in a science forum just claim its wrong... You do not have the proof of your conviction.
A sizable fraction of interested people see and read these postings. What you think and what we know are not the same thing.

[captain swoop]

The laws of Electromagnetism are incorrect, the law of attraction is correct, monopoles obey this law, look at the end result. (please use common sense)

OK you obviously didn't read my previous post. This forum os for Q&A on the Mainstream. We aren't interested in your ideas in this forum. That's what ATM is for. I am awarding you an infraction for ignoring Moderator warnings.

[Philippe Lemay]

I've heard of magnetic monopole technology over on Orion's Arm, and I was wondering...

http://www.orionsarm.com/eg-article/48630634d2591

How plausible is this concept? Is having these magnetic monopoles exist the only thing needed to make it plausible? Or are they stretching the truth out a little too far. They describe these magnetic-monopole-materials as being potentially thousands of times stronger than carbon nanotubes. Which would (arguably) make them millions of times stronger than steel.

So, yea, is this just fantasy?

[DrRocket]

I've heard of magnetic monopole technology over on Orion's Arm, and I was wondering...

http://www.orionsarm.com/eg-article/48630634d2591

How plausible is this concept? Is having these magnetic monopoles exist the only thing needed to make it plausible? Or are they stretching the truth out a little too far. They describe these magnetic-monopole-materials as being potentially thousands of times stronger than carbon nanotubes. Which would (arguably) make them millions of times stronger than steel.

So, yea, is this just fantasy?

"What is "Orion's Arm" you might ask? That is an excellent question, and in a nutshell here is your answer:
Orion's Arm is:

The next step in the evolution of science-fiction "

Pure fantasy.

[Philippe Lemay]

Well I don't know, they use some good stuff, like O'Neill Cylinders.

I just wanted to know if this one was also considered Hard SF. But apparently not.

[Van Rijn]

I've heard of magnetic monopole technology over on Orion's Arm, and I was wondering...

http://www.orionsarm.com/eg-article/48630634d2591

How plausible is this concept? Is having these magnetic monopoles exist the only thing needed to make it plausible?


No, it would also depend on the specific properties of the magnetic monopoles. We don't know if there are monopoles, how massive they are, and so forth.

Potentially, if there were significant quantities of magnetic monopoles it could allow for some pretty interesting possibilities, but find them first, work out the details after.

For Orion's Arm, it looks like they used it as a plausible sounding method to get to superstrong materials (like Niven's General Products hulls), but it's speculation.

[trinitree88]

Maxwell's equations prohibit monopoles as written.

[Strange]

One of the strongest is due to Dirac who showed that the existence of even one monopole, somewhere in the universe, would imply the quantization of electric charge.

Is it possible to give a non-technical summary explanation of why this is so?

(I assume the answer will be: "no")

[Disinfo Agent]

A previous thread that may be of interest. (http://www.bautforum.com/science-technology/93027-magnetic-monopoles-observed.html)